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  • Mock Draft / 2019 Offseason Thread

    Like the Knicks board maybe its time to start a new "offseason" thread that can last a year....

    Anyways would be interested in seeing everyone's mock using whatever sim you like.


    Here was my 7 round / no trade mock:

    1-6. Q. Williams - yeah I was surprised too, but if Bosa, Williams, or Allen is sitting there i throw the QB thing out the window @ 6. I did 5 sims Williams was my pick in 3 of them. Others were Haskins and Ed Oliver. I'm passing on White and Sweat here. White is awesome but I need a pass rush. Sweat gives the pass rush, but I worry about his fit in this D and his heart condition. Basically I'm big 3, Haskins, or trade back with this pick now.

    1-17. Haskins - Again this was a wonderful find...it'll never happen IMO. Haskins fell to 17 in 2 of the 5 sims. I grabbed him both times. Other picks - J Williams (2x) for RT and Christian Wilkins IDL.

    2-37. Chase Winovich - EDGE - Lots of choices here in 3 of my 5 mocks I went with Winovich - high football IQ, knows how to get to the QB, relentless motor. Consistently in the mock I've seen Risner, Dexter Lawrence (Snacks-lite), Justin Layne CB, and Savage/Thornhill (S). I like Risner a lot, but I like a lot of OL prospects in this draft that seem to be available in rounds 4-5. I'm going down the route of drafting one of them and signing a Remmers type to mentor only exceptions I'd consider if is Taylor or Williams make it to 17...would be hard to pass on them. Simmons is always on the board here too a legit top 10 talent, but I don't believe the Giants will touch him. That's a raider/cowboy/cleveland pick all the way. Once Tillery fell to here I snagged him. Savage was my other mock pick as I think he'd be an awesome FS.

    3-95. Joe-Giles Harris - LB - I love Harris. Doesn't have the athleticism of Burns or White, but has a higher football IQ and is maybe the best tackler in the draft. He's not sideline to sideline, but I think his smarts make up for that. I really feel like he's Antonio Pierce-like. Showed some promise as a straight-line blitzer as well. At this point in the sim, you start to get littered with WRs, TEs, and RBs. Other picks included - Ugochukwu Amadi (S) and Maxx Crosby (Edge).

    4-109. Tytus Howard - OT Probably at the top of my board in the 4th+ round tackles/Oline guys I like - along with Bobby Evans, Isaiah Prince (6th+), and Tyree St Louis (6th+). Picked him in 3 of my mocks. Darius Slayton (WR) was another pick here. Burner, vertical threat that I think would mix nice with Tate and Shep. Will Harris (S) is another guy in this area - played coverage out of slot, played in the box, and in CF. He's not going to be a big turnover guy, but he's not going to get beat deep. Given the Giants thin CB setup having a guy who can cover slot receivers, play in the box, or play deep helps them out.

    4-132. Michael Jackson - CB Physical man corner. CBs are usually out on an island in this D, he's a man cover guy not a zone which I think fits what Betcher wants to do. Other picks included Darius Slayton, Alize Mack (TE) - Not a burner, but a great route runner / jump ball guy. Very good pass blocker, okay on the run side. Daylon Mack (IDL) - big nimble rock in the middle. Steady push back, but will never be a high tackle for loss or QB pressure guy. Just clogs things up.

    At this point in every sim the board was littered with a host of folks I liked and ended up seeing a lot of the same names but picked them at completely different slots each time so not sure what anyone can draw from this, but to finish things off lets go....

    5-142. Darius Slayton - WR Somehow was still on the board here. See above for other options.

    5-143. Alize Mack - TE. Isaiah Buggs (IDL) was another thought in this area. Not a special athlete, but big size, good motor, great hands...can play all over a DL. Like him a lot here

    5-171. Sheldrick Redwine - S . I like both Redwine and Worthington and basically split between the two as late 5th/early 6th round picks. I think both offer solid deep safety work, good tackling, and strong special teams contributions. Basically flip a coin. Other picks here for me was again Buggs and Isiah Prince (OT).

    6-180. Isaiah Buggs - IDL Been sitting there considering him since the 5th....finally pulled the trigger. Prince was also here often. Worthington/Redwine as well. Lots of value at WR at this point as well...took a stab at Gary Jennings Jr. in one of my mocks. 5 mocks, 5 different picks here for me as well.

    7-232. Austin Bryant - EDGE Part of Clemson's D. Probably the least athletic of the group, but he was very productive giving 15+ tackles for loss / 8+ sacks each of the last 2 years. Tyree St Loius (OT), Jalen Hurd (WR) big 6-4 converted RB - awesome hands, good speed, great blocker - not a typical Giant in that his route running has a long ways to go, but given how new he is to the position something to work with. Gary Jennings Jr was also here a lot.

    7-245. Gary Jennings Jr.


    Crazy as it may seem I think there's some value in keeping their picks this year tho logic and Gettleman's past tells you to deal some to move up/around...however I actually like a lot of the later round talent in this draft. I think will be tremendous value in the 4th and 5th rounds if the top gets as d-Line/edge crazy as we think it will...




  • #2
    Problem with keeping all the picks is the roster space. There's little chance you can roster 12 picks along with any potential UDFA's. So making some moves to package them to move up for higher rated players or picks to 2020 would be the better use of resources.

    I'm seeing more and more the prospect of Williams falling to 6. Still wouldn't expect it but if Arizona goes Bosa then the next few picks are going to be really interesting. I've started hearing Oliver's name come up more around the 6th pick. Talk is that he's undersized as a DT (comparison is Donald though that's a lofty expectation) but in a 3-4 he could be more of a DE where his size and athleticism can play and move inside for pass rush downs. Burn's also being mentioned. Not as much Sweat recently but could be smoke.

    I mentioned in the other thread that some are starting to view Haskins as the 4th QB. Reasons cited are lack of mobility and how he dealt with pressure. Giants are reporting that they are having him come in for a visit and he's really a no brainer pick at 17 given that he'll need at least a year to develop some and doesn't seem like the prototypical QB who can step in early in the season. With Manning I think they'll give him at least 8-10 weeks before they even think of pulling in him

    Personally, I like Winovich but not at the early pick in the 2nd. From what I've read he's undersized and will have a lot of trouble going against pro-tackles in that he doesn't have many pass rush moves.I also don't think doubling down on the DL is the right move either when you take into account in this mock they already have Williams, signed Marcus Golden to be that pass-rush LB, and also have McIntosh for a full training camp to see what he can do. But, if I were to double down on the DL I would have gone Lawrence since he has higher upside and at a minimum will be an upper level run stopper. If I had to choose between everyone you said was still there I would have gone Risner. Sure up the OL since both Manning and Haskin's will not be good without the ability to give them some time and a clean pocket.

    I don't really look at mocks much further than the 2nd. After that it gets to be more personal preferences on players most of us really don't read or know much about. I will mention that I've heard Howard (4th round pick) seems to be moving up boards. A couple places think he could go in the 2nd round. McShay's recent mock has him going pick 37 to the Giants.
    Last edited by dak11; 04-15-2019, 02:55 PM.

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    • #3
      Well I look at the depth on the Dline/Edge situation.... right now you've got Hill, Thomlinson, and a bunch of unknowns.... I think they need 2-3 players along the line there....I went with a more inside push - Williams and then a standup guy on the outside Winovich. My interior depth came later with Buggs. Golden is a bonus player IMO....he played 11 games last year after playing 4 the year before....he'll be 3 years removed from his big season so I still think they need that standup rusher..He might be the starter but I'm not counting on him being productive for a whole season....I wanted to get one early because I don't see a potential impact standup rusher much beyond the 2nd round.....while I do see some interior run stuffer/multiple blocker types that will probably be available in the 4th-6th rounds - guys like ...Buggs, Slayton, Daylon Mack. I agree Winovich has some potential faults, but given the draft board there I think he was by far the best Edge. Reach? Maybe...but I've seen plenty of mocks with him crashing the end of the first round. He won't make it past the mid-point of the 2nd IMO.


      I like Lawerence but he kind of falls into the same thing as Risner for me. I wont cry with either being pick #37, but I think both are a significant step back from the tops of their class in those roles and at the same time not miles ahead of some guys who should be around later. If Tillery or Wilkins falls to 37 I'd do the dance of joy. If Williams or Taylor fall to 17 same deal there. Those few exceptions aside I think there's very good/projectable OTs that should be around in the 3rd+ rounds. I've also heard the same on Howard...I'd be fine taking Bobby Evans in that early 4th slot too. I think both are plug and play RTs. Risner is good, but if the choice is between a standup edge or a RT I think I'd go edge just about every time as the gap between Risner/Evans/Howard to me is smaller than the gap between Winovich and say Maxx Crosby or someone like that..... Also isn't one of Gettleman's strengths supposedly finding those 4th-5th round OL?

      Again all of this is a little part of simulator bias too....basically by the end of the 3rd round you've usually got a 1/2 dozen top 100 rated RBs, WRs, and such available while you've already moved into the 180+ zone rating wise on Edge / CBs / etc... but always interesting to see where names ultimately pop up



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      • #4
        There's an eternity between their 2nd round pick 37 and 3rd pick 95. I think that's the spot where they will try to move up using some of their other draft capital.
        My EntireTeam Sucks...

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        • #5
          https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2019/4/...dwayne-haskins


          interesting article ....confirms my fear on Jones. Draws some comparison between Lock, Rosen, and Allen as well.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by MrHat View Post
            https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2019/4/...dwayne-haskins


            interesting article ....confirms my fear on Jones. Draws some comparison between Lock, Rosen, and Allen as well.
            Another reason why Grier has been moving up boards where he's being in the discussion in the late 1st round now. He has flaws but you can't teach completion percentage and he was pretty good over his career.

            I'm starting to wonder if they'll try another mid round guy to see if they can develop him and go BPA in the first 2 rounds. All of these QB's have some kind of flaw and Gettleman has said from the start that making the wrong QB pick could set back a franchise for years.

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            • #7
              Well end those Wilson thoughts right now....he's locked up to a 4 year extension.

              Grier's arm motion just doesn't look right to me. Seriously looks like he's going to hurt himself throwing the ball and even tho I guess the numbers say he gets the ball out fast, to me it looks like he has a significant windup. There's rumbling he's the Pats guy, but I don't think they are going to look for a QB that early.

              I guess I'd be okay with Grier *IF* there's a Q. Williams fall to 6. In fact get both Williams - Q and Jonah then snag a 2nd round QB? Okay. I still think Haskins is significantly better, but in that scenario I could live with it. Again tho I'm just tired of the take a flier type pick. If the QB is your guy of the future you should have no worries about using #6 on him at worst 17. I think the above article actually shows how much Haskin's is being UNDERVALUED - at least by the media/mockers right now. He's barely a tick behind Murray who's still the concensus #1 (53.4 vs. 53.2), while being the most accurate, having the best measurables, and the most pre-snap responsibility of the top 3-4 guys in this draft...plus seemingly the personality/intelligence to handle NY. Admittedly havent heard much of Grier talking/breaking down plays, but Murray *shudder* think he'd be a disaster here. Again I think he fits this offense to a T and a team that's going to be built upon really crisp route running, guys with great hands, and the ability to gain YAC. His effectiveness in the screen game at Ohio brings all kinds of thoughts in my mind to what he can do with Barkley and Engram....putting the ball in the right spot so those guys can make plays.

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              • #8
                Charlie Weiss was saying this morning on NFL radio that Grier would be his choice at QB. Mature (older with a family) with a lot of experience, played at 2 different schools so he's dealt with learning offenses, started as a freshman and was productive though college career. Also stated the guy is a gym rat and loves watching film. Out of all the QB's Weiss, for what it's worth, thinks he's the most ready to step in and play right away. Also stated the fact that his cost out of all of them is also most reasonable in that teams would keep their 1st round picks to use on another player.

                Honestly, too much info going around. I've actually heard some rumbles that they could also be thinking about Hockenson at 6. Too early to take him IMO but he fits the mold of what Gettleman seems to look for in a player this those early picks. HOF ability and he fills a need. You add him and they have the makings of an offense built similarly to NE. 2 matchup problems at TE, a couple undersized short passing matchup issues at WR, and RB who can catch passes out of the back field.

                The draft can't come quick enough.

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                • #9
                  I could see Hock at 17...not 6....that would be a complete waste

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                  • #10
                    Anyone want to throw up some this morning?

                    http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap300...ock-to-packers

                    Daniel Jeremiah latest mock. Daniel Jones at pick 6. He does have Sweat dropping to 17 which by all indications will never happen.

                    Other notable picks - Oliver at 3 (Jets), Jonah Williams pick 8 (Lions) as a OG, Devin White at 10 (Broncos), and Drew Lock to Packers.

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                    • #11
                      I think we all kind of agree any draft that has Daniel Jones in the first round is going to be bad start. The Gary/Jones mocks are most people's doomsdays.

                      I actually don't mind Gary so much depending on who else was available, but the combo of two pretty major projects in a draft that has some seemingly can't miss guys is pretty terrible

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                      • #12
                        I don't mind Gary at 17. If they were looking for an athletic freak I'd go with Oliver way before Gary. At least Oliver showed some production in college.

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                        • #13
                          As I said depending who was available at 6 I wouldn’t totally hate Gary there either. Oliver could be off the board for example - if you have a situation where Zona picks Bosa 1 and no one goes up to get a QB or only 1 QB goes off the board even - I could see a Bosa, Williams, Allen, Oliver all going in the top 5 - and you *might* be choosing between Sweat / White - 1 of which could also be gone in this situation and then Gary....I’d lean Sweat, but there’s enough concerns off-field, health wise, etc that I wouldn’t blow a gasket if they took Gary in that kind of situation. By far not my first choice, but not nearly as vomit inducing as Jones... There’s some history of athletic freaks producing mediocre college numbers before blowing up in the pros - Watt, JPP, etc.

                          There’s 0 chance Gary makes it 17 IMO.

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                          • #14
                            Probably not but Gary is a bit of head scratcher. Tons of athleticism with little production. Because of that mocks I've seen have him anywhere from top 5 into the teens. I agree that he probably won't last until pick 17 but that someone with his combine numbers isn't a consensus top 5 type pick just shows how risky taking him would be, especially at 6.

                            Now, I wouldn't go crazy is he was picked as the Giants and their scouts would know more than me. I just think there are other guys at pick 6 who've shown more production with similar athletic traits. He also makes me nervous with this sport agency he's starting up.


                            Giants have a ton of picks already and they're not a wheel and deal type of team who moves back and/or all over the place but I wonder if they are not in love with haskins that the possibility to trade down a few spots would be available. See if Cincy, Denver, or Miami would look to move up for that QB. They might be able to get another 2nd plus another pick from those teams and still be in the area where they might be able to get a Gary, Sweat, Lock, Hockenson, etc.

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                            • #15
                              Yep I've got no problem trading down if they aren't going Haskins and one of the big three don't drop. I think the talent range of the 5-20 guys is all relatively close. Greedy vs Murphy. Sweat vs Ferrel. White vs. Burns. Oliver vs. Gary etc. Makes total sense to me in a non QB pick

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