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2017-18 OFFSEASON

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  • Ugly rumor that Butler pulled a D. Fisher and banged KAT;s GF..that would surely explain alot..but find it hard to believe in the world we now live in..it didnt come out alot sooner if true..

    As far as trading for him..

    You are forgetting the other STUD player Knicks can/should offer to help get it done : LANCE F*king Thomas.. defensive oriented player on what amounts to an expiring for Thibs to play with..

    Lee/Thomas/Mudiay 2nd round pick.. I think both Lee and Thomas are both Thibs type players....Willing to sub THJ if they prefer..but I dont think they would..with Wiggins there..

    I too am wary of Butlers perceived inabilty to get along with teamates..I also think adding both will stunt Knox's growth..but if you guys really want Kyrie as a Knick..you have to investigate this and see if its possible.. I personally not 1000% aboard the Kyrie must be a knick train..I have fall back plans in mind (as I have stated previously).

    I am curious as to Clips. vision..do they envision a Kyrie/Butler back court or are they looking at Butler/Leonard? I say the latter would be good news for Knicks as it would mean Kyrie would be more likely to come here..and also would weaken the East futher with kawhi out West..so win-win potentially..
    ACCEPTED TRUTH: That I will be ROYALLY F**CKED OVER by EVERY TEAM I ROOT FOR (METS, JETS & KNICKS) !!!

    Citifield & Mets...the place where Sluggers Careers go to DIE"

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTLzr2Al_Os

    Comment


    • Didn't you hear Fitz? Lance is a leader and point forward. He's even featured on the Knicks portrait this year (Lee is not btw).

      Comment


      • Originally posted by MrHat View Post
        Didn't you hear Fitz? Lance is a leader and point forward. He's even featured on the Knicks portrait this year (Lee is not btw).
        Its called "Inflating value" ..see he is being featured..he MUST BE A GOOD PLAYER... Team should include Kat in deal too if they(Butler) didnt hate each other so much..for such a great player as Thomas...lol..


        I just wonder who/what on Clips would appeal to Thibs in return...not much there besides picks..dont know if they would give up Shai already..Tobias doesnt seem like a thibs type player..

        The more I read..the more I see that THJ would almost need to be included in deal for Butler to allow possibilty to even get a 2nd max.. (streatch Noah AND LEE renounce all rest of FA)
        ACCEPTED TRUTH: That I will be ROYALLY F**CKED OVER by EVERY TEAM I ROOT FOR (METS, JETS & KNICKS) !!!

        Citifield & Mets...the place where Sluggers Careers go to DIE"

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTLzr2Al_Os

        Comment


        • I just ask this....if available right now would you sign Butler for 5 years 190 mil?

          F no. Again the only way I'd trade for Butler is to get out of other contract (Lee/Noah/Hardaway) and then I'd walk away at the end of the year. Dude may be a good player...I can even buy for the next 3 years he'll be a top 20ish player....after that the decline is going to be ugly. He doesn't have a game that ages well. As he loses lateral quickness, the D is going to drop quickly. His O game is like Burke - living off of mid-range jumpers. He's awesome at it now, but it takes very little for that to quickly become a negative.

          Comment


          • Wrong player wrong time yadda yadda yadda. Reports are that Kyrie hasn't even talked with Butler at any length about "the future" since they played together during the Olympics in 2016. That stupid fake news article from a few months back about them teaming up in NY got the sheep excited about nothing. Enough of these drama queen players. Problem with even trading our dead weight for him (which isn't realistic at all) is that once traded for he expects an extension on the spot. Again let this guy poison the Nets or Clippers. Stay the course.

            In other news the Noah buyout/stretch is imminent. I still think they should let him rot, but this is what they have to do to free up space for 2019 free agency. Like with most situations the Knicks put themselves in it's not ideal, but it's what they got.
            My EntireTeam Sucks...

            Comment


            • Yeah it sounds like he's being stretched...not really bought out. I guess the Knicks are trying to negotiate a lower stretch + buyout....meaning that they are going to try to chop into the 38 mil he's owned. If he leaves the Vet min on the table for this year and next then the contract goes down to ~32 mil...they could pay him his "full salary" this year ~$18 mil...then knock 5 off of next year's and they'd stretch that ~13 mil over 3 years rather than 18. Meaning his hit would be ~4 mil per vs. 6 going forward. That's better than a pure stretch....

              I still rather just do a straight buyout or let him rot, but I get it. If they can get that down below a 5 mil hit, its probably a smart move.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by MrHat View Post
                Yeah it sounds like he's being stretched...not really bought out. I guess the Knicks are trying to negotiate a lower stretch + buyout....meaning that they are going to try to chop into the 38 mil he's owned. If he leaves the Vet min on the table for this year and next then the contract goes down to ~32 mil...they could pay him his "full salary" this year ~$18 mil...then knock 5 off of next year's and they'd stretch that ~13 mil over 3 years rather than 18. Meaning his hit would be ~4 mil per vs. 6 going forward. That's better than a pure stretch....

                I still rather just do a straight buyout or let him rot, but I get it. If they can get that down below a 5 mil hit, its probably a smart move.

                Knicks Film School@KnickFilmSchool
                From a cap standpoint, itís simple:

                If Knicks stretch Noah and he gives back some money (i.e. $7MM), depending on the actual 2019 cap number ...

                New York could have just enough space for a MAX SLOT IN 2019 by simply renouncing their own free agents and waiving Lance Thomas
                9:34 AM - Sep 23, 2018


                KEY POINT... they dont even HAVE to trade Lee..if Noah gives up some $$ . If he follows Deng's example..doesnt seem to unreasonable since he stole all he got thus far..but..who knows..

                The dumping of Kyrie+THJ would allow for the SECOND possible max player to become a possibility..til then..no point in dreaming..

                Getting Butler was all about having the BEST chance at Kyrie personally in my mind....since now its being said they are NOT attached at hip so to speak..then all bets are off..another recent report sayys Kyrie doesnt want to leave Boston and Knicks presumed target future home overblown... who knows..that to me is as always all about the $$ if Boston tries to lowball him then..sure he will cast goo-ggo eyes at Knicks direction..but otherwise..this can/will end up being usual scenario of Knicks gettting left with crumbs in FA to offer max $$ to..lets hope they dont Amare' the situation out desperation and give out the $$ to a lesser player..
                ACCEPTED TRUTH: That I will be ROYALLY F**CKED OVER by EVERY TEAM I ROOT FOR (METS, JETS & KNICKS) !!!

                Citifield & Mets...the place where Sluggers Careers go to DIE"

                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTLzr2Al_Os

                Comment


                • Well Butler could still be the best way to get Kyrie...simply by clearing out more long term salary (again THJ + Lee for Butler scenarios)....buuuuut its still gotta be a red flag that now 2 teams "kids" have complained about him.... and I still really want a top 5-6 pick this year more than I want Butler.

                  I still wanna trade Lee for salary relief..but I guess it doesn't have to be this season....just before next

                  Comment


                  • I think more plan b's need to be thought of.. Not as convinced as before that Kyrie will come here either. . Butler +max was the carrot.. Now it seems neither one was perhaps a given that would be an enticement enough..

                    If we truly want to stay clear of problems child/divas..then the plan should remain develop our own star(s)..tank/draft..add another top pick ride out the bad contracts and revisit fa in 2021..let the top players now go out west to boot!
                    ACCEPTED TRUTH: That I will be ROYALLY F**CKED OVER by EVERY TEAM I ROOT FOR (METS, JETS & KNICKS) !!!

                    Citifield & Mets...the place where Sluggers Careers go to DIE"

                    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTLzr2Al_Os

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by 86mets View Post
                      I think more plan b's need to be thought of.. Not as convinced as before that Kyrie will come here either. . Butler +max was the carrot.. Now it seems neither one was perhaps a given that would be an enticement enough..

                      If we truly want to stay clear of problems child/divas..then the plan should remain develop our own star(s)..tank/draft..add another top pick ride out the bad contracts and revisit fa in 2021..let the top players now go out west to boot!
                      If that's the plan then they shouldn't stretch Noah. To me, they are going to make a statement if/when they stretch him. The only reason to do it is ensure you have max cap space for 2019.

                      If Kyrie isn't real. I believe Durant would laugh at the thought of NY. Butler too much baggage. Then you look at Kemba, Klay, Evans, etc. Doesn't mean you go max on any of those guys, but you've put a stake in the ground that you're basically forgoing the big 2020 class by carrying some portion of Noah's deal beyond next year. This is largely why I've been in favor of just letting Noah rot.

                      So much depends on what happens with Knox, Frank, Robinson, and how KP recovers this year. Why tie up any money in the future without knowing the answer to those questions? Work a straight buyout with Noah before FA time if you can't find a taker for Lee during the season *IF* the progress of those players above dictate the need to have max room. Till then, stay the course. If Knox has a breakout kind of year and KP looks 100% you may not even need a max player...you may need just some role players to put around them. If he's a big pile of suck or KP looks like a shell, you'll need a lot more than what 1 max guy can give you.

                      Comment


                      • https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2018/09/...wish-list.html

                        I dont know Heats cap situation..but could a southbeach reunion be on horizon and Kyrie potentially follows him there..

                        Adam Kaufman@AdamMKaufman
                        Kyrie Irving, on his future, to @Toucherandrich: "It's easy to follow. I'm from New Jersey. But it's rumors, rumors, rumors. ... It's easy to draw that connection - New York City - but why would I want to leave here?" #Celtics
                        8:24 AM - Sep 26, 2018


                        Anywho..I dont see Klay coming here either..Kemba..perhaps but on an overpay which I just as soon pass on...thats the thing ..seems like the top end stars are going to NEW teams on pkg. deal type scenarios..whether it be current or wink wink under the table see you there in a year..without breakout season by current Knicks..getting harder to see any join Knicks in near future..Knicks pass on this coming years crop..then it will start the talk of putting all the eggs in on the Giannis basket for 2021..Here to hoping our own kids blossom to studs !
                        ACCEPTED TRUTH: That I will be ROYALLY F**CKED OVER by EVERY TEAM I ROOT FOR (METS, JETS & KNICKS) !!!

                        Citifield & Mets...the place where Sluggers Careers go to DIE"

                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTLzr2Al_Os

                        Comment


                        • Well things can change, but again I don't think there's a ton of teams with max cap room coming up in 2019 - didn't I post it before? like 8ish - with several of those unlikely ready to or attractive for significant FAs (Hi Atlanta, Orlando, Sacramento)....so guys like Kemba might have to take less if you assume the Klay, Irving, Butler, Durant, Leonard, etc crew are all going max.....especially if they don't want to be banished to abyss of the NBA.

                          Durant / Klay really will change things a lot. The Warriors need both of them to settle for less than max to keep them....I don't think either really wants to go hang out with Lebron. I think it's likely 1 stays and 1 goes.

                          You've also got guys like Cousins - who could end up as a max if he bounces back, Middleton, Harris, Dragic, Randle, deAndre Jordan....

                          Again how Knox performs as a 3 and what happens with Robinson / Frank development can change this teams needs a lot. While everyone keeps wanting to pencil KP in as a 5 going forward, I'm still not sold on it.

                          It'll be interesting...preseason starts tonight with "all spots open" which is a nice thing for Fiz to say, but also completely stupid if he actually puts it into action. Frank and Knox better be starting for this club no matter how "good" Lance / Lee / Mario / Burke / Mudiay / etc look. The goal isn't the 8th seed or even 30 wins this year....its to make sure those 2 guys are given every chance to develop / improve

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                          • A big YIKES tonight even though it's just game one preseason, but the starting 5 is Burke, THJ, Knox, Thomas, Kanter.

                            The yikes is Thomas obviously and Fizdale reasoning for it. Said hes the team leader. Obviously lots of things will change over the season, but come on Thomas is dog ****. I don't buy this leadership bull. Play THE TALENT
                            My EntireTeam Sucks...

                            Comment


                            • I actually read Hezonja was in starting lineup tonught at the #4...they will give up 120+ points on D with that lineup..

                              I think Henzonja's offense will be needed more off the bench though..hoping Vonleh shows something..he could be the #4 team needs perhaps..

                              Sure are dragging out this Noah thing arent they..
                              ACCEPTED TRUTH: That I will be ROYALLY F**CKED OVER by EVERY TEAM I ROOT FOR (METS, JETS & KNICKS) !!!

                              Citifield & Mets...the place where Sluggers Careers go to DIE"

                              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTLzr2Al_Os

                              Comment


                              • https://dailyknicks.com/2018/10/01/n...season-opener/

                                Yep was just going to post the same....ugh. And look Burke from his effort last year probably deserves to start, but come on....he's not a starting caliber player in the league *unless* he can both match his unprecedented offensive numbers (dude shot like 60% from mid-range which is just not sustainable) from last year AND significantly improve his D (which was the worst on the Knicks - and that's saying something).

                                Just watch and laugh at the pick and roll D from Burke/Kanter...that's going to be some horrific stuff out there.

                                Has the NBA gotten so shitty that Lance Thomas is now really truly viewed as an NBA 4? Forget the fact that he just flat out sucks in pretty much all phases of the game outside of "ugly looking shots" and floor dives where he's a pro's pro - but 6'7" 230 is a 4 today? I mean **** maybe we got it all wrong and Frank's future is actually as a PF?!?! He's got an inch and 15 pounds to go - this next summer follows the same track he'll be good to go - already plays better D, rebounds, and passes, better than Lance...with a longer wing span.

                                I still have a used car salesman vibe from Fiz and this, tho only a stupid meaningless pre-season game, doesn't do him any favors


                                If it was me I'd like to see a starting lineup of Frank, THj, Knox, Vonleh, Kanter in the preseason -forces Frank and Knox into offensive roles. Burke, Lee, Dotson, Mario, Robinson bench - yeah potentially scary bad defensively, but I'd be curious to see how these groups operate together
                                Last edited by MrHat; 10-01-2018, 02:58 PM.

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