Bobby V article - Page 3

metman · 02-07-2010, 10:26 PM

He was smug and got on my nerves. I won't miss him one bit. Sure, he did get a lot out of his bums but he also wanted to play his bums all god damn day.

What really is apparent, though, through this discussion is just how AWFUL Steve Phillips was. Horrible late inning relievers, horrible outfielders etc. What's even worse is that Doubleday was the one the media always said, behind the scenes, was the one who pushed for Piazza.

It wasn't Fred Wilpon. Doubleday was bought out and, as we know, the rest was history.

Sports Doctor · 02-07-2010, 11:22 PM

Well it keeps being avoided that the owners are the same drizzel in all scenarios. Get these ****ers out and until the mass Met fan can't stand it and begins a mass slander of the Wilpons we'll all have to suffer. I mean we still got Yes men like NYROmy running around sayin the Mets are great how dare you question them, and then other douches sayin I'll still buy tickets cause Im a fool..and "Im glad they didn;t soend money this off season" and ignore the 15 guys who could have helped this team on 1 yr cheap ass deals. This franchise will be ****ed as long as the Wilpons run it until all the fans boycott or t hey go bankrupt, otherwise its obvious the way they run the team is not working.

Green Must Go · 02-08-2010, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sports Doctor

Well it keeps being avoided that the owners are the same drizzel in all scenarios. Get these ****ers out and until the mass Met fan can't stand it and begins a mass slander of the Wilpons we'll all have to suffer. I mean we still got Yes men like NYROmy running around sayin the Mets are great how dare you question them, and then other douches sayin I'll still buy tickets cause Im a fool..and "Im glad they didn;t soend money this off season" and ignore the 15 guys who could have helped this team on 1 yr cheap ass deals. This franchise will be ****ed as long as the Wilpons run it until all the fans boycott or t hey go bankrupt, otherwise its obvious the way they run the team is not working.

That about sums it up. Just like the old Joe Torre could do nothing with the late 70's Mets, no good manager is going to be able to do much with this dreck of a team the Wilpoons have assembled.

krunchyfrogg · 02-08-2010, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sports Doctor

People have short memories, V's act was tiresome by the time he got booted. Anyone remember 150 diff lineups in 160 games? Yeah Im sure the players loved that.

x2

MetfanBren · 02-08-2010, 10:05 PM

Valentine used 150 different lineups because most of the time the roster he had was not very good at all. He had a lot more Agbayani's, Everett's, and Huskey's than Wright's, Beltran's, and even Delgado's. The only time he had a real good roster was '99, and that lineup was pretty constant, especially at the end when the platoons worked themselves out real well (Cedeno/Agbayani, Hamilton/Dunston). Even then he was getting a lot of players who were winding down, or where never that good again...

People make it sound like he was shuffling all stars around instead of minimum wage veterans and/or overachievers. I doubt he would have messed around constantly with the talent the 2006-2008 clubs have had, unless it was to kick one or two of them in the arse when they needed it...

metman · 02-08-2010, 10:08 PM

I honestly believe he loves to hear how brilliant he is. Proof? He's the only g.d manager to not win jack **** who we, to this day, hear how brilliant he is.

True, he didn't have a ton to work with but it was clear that he loved his scrubs to death.

MetfanBren · 02-08-2010, 10:16 PM

He won 59 games less than the immortal Davey Johnson, with a fraction of the talent, and none of the pitching. I'm not sure that Davey's two post-seasons were any more impressive when you look at the rosters and the competition they had to deal with (Braves vs. Cards?)...

You can't say that he loved to be the smartest guy in the room or he loved his scrubs until you give him the chance not to. The notion that a smart Baseball man will become stupid when given a ton of high priced talent is the kind of backward thinking that has doomed the Mets for generations, and probably will for more....

James D. · 02-08-2010, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sports Doctor

"Im glad they didn;t soend money this off season" and ignore the 15 guys who could have helped this team on 1 yr cheap ass deals.

That's the thing that amazes me. With the market being what it is, and so many guys available for one year deals, there was zero reason (other than penny pinching or financial hardship) not to roll the dice on a few guys who might help this team compete. I can't imagine why any Mets fan would be happy that they did so little this off-season.

Bay Ridge Dave · 02-09-2010, 11:19 AM

The sad part is that Omar STILL can make the roster better, but good luck on that one...

Omar Minaya can still save New York Mets roster by signing bargain free agents - NYPOST.com

Quote:

With the Mets, it is difficult to determine whether they are trying to spin the news or are just delusional.

Consider the state of the roster: For most of this offseason, they acknowledged a desire to upgrade at catcher, second base, slugging (even beyond Jason Bay) and the rotation.

Now, with spring training nine days away, Mets officials are suddenly pleased with a group that has Omir Santos catching, Luis Castillo still at second, little lefty power and the same rotation that so disappointed last year.

Here is what Mets officials are trying to sell either to you and/or themselves:

1) The health will be better so they will be better. Of course, Carlos Beltran already is not healthy.

2) Off of the embarrassment of last year, this group will be energized to prove naysayers wrong. Of course shouldn’t that have been the mindset after choking in both 2007 and ’08?

3) The prices were not right for free agents they wanted (read Bengie Molina and Joel Pineiro) and they have better internal options than what’s left in free agency.

I don’t agree. The Mets can still bargain shop. They were willing to spend about $12 million in 2010 on Molina and Pineiro. So, in theory, they have at least that to spend. The Mets would tell you there is no use spending just for spending’s sake. I agree. But the Mets still lack depth, and lack of depth — more than lack of character — has been their biggest nemesis the past few years.

For roughly $12 million, the Mets could still probably have catcher Rod Barajas, first baseman Russell Branyan, reliever Kiko Calero, utilityman Felipe Lopez and starter Jarrod Washburn to deepen every facet of their roster. Obviously, they are not signing them all, but they should be thinking of some because:

BARAJAS — His on-base percentage is atrocious, like Molina’s, and Barajas, who played for the Blue Jays last season, has a tendency to add weight. But an executive who had Barajas said: “He is a great guy, he’s smart and pitchers like throwing to him. He does not walk, but he will hit .240 with 15 homers and play good defense. You could do a lot worse, and Omir Santos is worse.”

The Mets obviously know they are best served with Santos and Josh Thole at Triple-A for depth because they recently re-engaged Arizona about Chris Snyder. But despite public proclamations that they are fine financially, the Mets might have real cash-flow issues — and can’t afford anything else now — since they told the D’backs that Arizona had to eat almost all of Snyder’s $4.75 million 2010 contract or no deal. So no deal.

BRANYAN — The Mets have 11 players on their 40-man roster who either switch-hit or bat lefty, and that group combined for 26 homers from the left side in 2,634 at-bats last year. Or five fewer than Branyan hit even missing the final month of the season.The most accomplished of the Mets from the left side is switch-hitter Beltran, who will miss at least six weeks. So the Mets are again relying too much on Daniel Murphy.

Maybe Branyan’s back is not healed. But the Mets were willing to do a low-base, big-incentive deal with Carlos Delgado; shouldn’t they be thinking the same for Branyan?

CALERO — The Mets could have a strong set-up group if Kelvim Escobar is healthy and Ryota Igarashi translates well from Japan. But that is fragile. There are some potentially helpful guys out there such as Mike MacDougal, Chan Ho Park or David Weathers. But Calero allowed just 5.4 hits per nine innings last year while averaging better than a strikeout an inning for the Marlins.

LOPEZ — His body language is not great. But Lopez, who split last season between the Diamondbacks and Brewers, can get on base, is a better utilityman than Alex Cora or Anderson Hernandez, and — let’s be frank — he would be starting over Castillo by May 1.

WASHBURN — If his knee is healthy, Washburn, who shone for the Mariners last year before getting traded to Detroit, where he struggled and got hurt, is the kind of innings eater the Mets felt they needed with so much volatility in their rotation. And rather than having Fernando Nieve or Jonathon Niese as the No. 5 starter, both would now provide depth.

nique · 02-11-2010, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by krunchyfrogg

x2

x3

The team quit on him. A running theme with this org.

MetfanBren · 02-11-2010, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bay Ridge Dave

The sad part is that Omar STILL can make the roster better, but good luck on that one...

Omar Minaya can still save New York Mets roster by signing bargain free agents - NYPOST.com

If it's difficult to determine what the front office is thinking, then why are we dissecting the roster as if it's functioning normally? People who think that Omar would have watched all of this happen while he had real power are delusional. He would have blown it up even bigger if he were really in charge with real money to spend. I don't know which would have been worse, but nobody changes their stripes this fast unless they're forced to...

nique · 02-12-2010, 10:13 AM

Another thing about Valentine. If he was so great why hasn't he been offered (or has he?) another MLB managing job.

MetfanBren · 02-12-2010, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nique

Another thing about Valentine. If he was so great why hasn't he been offered (or has he?) another MLB managing job.

Because roughly 90 wins per year isn't good enough when you keep recycling crap like Dusty Baker?

02-07-2010, 10:26 PM	#31 (permalink)
metman Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 11,204	He was smug and got on my nerves. I won't miss him one bit. Sure, he did get a lot out of his bums but he also wanted to play his bums all god damn day. What really is apparent, though, through this discussion is just how AWFUL Steve Phillips was. Horrible late inning relievers, horrible outfielders etc. What's even worse is that Doubleday was the one the media always said, behind the scenes, was the one who pushed for Piazza. It wasn't Fred Wilpon. Doubleday was bought out and, as we know, the rest was history. __________________ Liberals aren't the problem... they are what allow the problem(s) to exist.

02-07-2010, 11:22 PM	#32 (permalink)
Sports Doctor Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 4,864	Well it keeps being avoided that the owners are the same drizzel in all scenarios. Get these **ers out and until the mass Met fan can't stand it and begins a mass slander of the Wilpons we'll all have to suffer. I mean we still got Yes men like NYROmy running around sayin the Mets are great how dare you question them, and then other douches sayin I'll still buy tickets cause Im a fool..and "Im glad they didn;t soend money this off season" and ignore the 15 guys who could have helped this team on 1 yr cheap ass deals. This franchise will be **ed as long as the Wilpons run it until all the fans boycott or t hey go bankrupt, otherwise its obvious the way they run the team is not working. __________________ "Michael Jackson, the most famous white lady to die since Princess Diana." - Bill Maher

02-08-2010, 10:05 PM	#35 (permalink)
MetfanBren Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Pearl River, NY Posts: 5,253	Valentine used 150 different lineups because most of the time the roster he had was not very good at all. He had a lot more Agbayani's, Everett's, and Huskey's than Wright's, Beltran's, and even Delgado's. The only time he had a real good roster was '99, and that lineup was pretty constant, especially at the end when the platoons worked themselves out real well (Cedeno/Agbayani, Hamilton/Dunston). Even then he was getting a lot of players who were winding down, or where never that good again... People make it sound like he was shuffling all stars around instead of minimum wage veterans and/or overachievers. I doubt he would have messed around constantly with the talent the 2006-2008 clubs have had, unless it was to kick one or two of them in the arse when they needed it... __________________ "Maybe they just don't need good players? " ~ Keith Law on the Mets draft(s) budget

02-08-2010, 10:08 PM	#36 (permalink)
metman Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 11,204	I honestly believe he loves to hear how brilliant he is. Proof? He's the only g.d manager to not win jack ** who we, to this day, hear how brilliant he is. True, he didn't have a ton to work with but it was clear that he loved his scrubs to death. __________________ Liberals aren't the problem...** they are what allow the problem(s) to exist.

02-08-2010, 10:16 PM	#37 (permalink)
MetfanBren Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Pearl River, NY Posts: 5,253	He won 59 games less than the immortal Davey Johnson, with a fraction of the talent, and none of the pitching. I'm not sure that Davey's two post-seasons were any more impressive when you look at the rosters and the competition they had to deal with (Braves vs. Cards?)... You can't say that he loved to be the smartest guy in the room or he loved his scrubs until you give him the chance not to. The notion that a smart Baseball man will become stupid when given a ton of high priced talent is the kind of backward thinking that has doomed the Mets for generations, and probably will for more.... __________________ "Maybe they just don't need good players? " ~ Keith Law on the Mets draft(s) budget

02-12-2010, 10:13 AM	#42 (permalink)
nique Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 272	Another thing about Valentine. If he was so great why hasn't he been offered (or has he?) another MLB managing job.

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